Jordyn Duggar, Jim Bob Duggar, Jennifer Duggar, Johannah Duggar
Photo courtesy duggarfamily.com
Monday, January 20, 2020
Duggars March for Life 2020
Photo courtesy duggarfamily.com
258 comments:
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Its fine that JB is doing something like that...but in my opinion he shouldn't use his kids for these occasions... It would be nice if they could decide themselves to do things like that when they have the age for it...
ReplyDeleteChildren are able to discern that murder is wrong completely on their own - in fact it is written on everyone's heart.
DeleteThey have decided anon 3:57. The girls are not being held against their will..They are clearly there because they want to stand up for the rights of the unborn. And yes, they are absolutely old enough to make that decision.
DeleteMaybe they did decide they wanted to be there? Have you had the chance to ask them?
DeleteBut I’m sure you’re fine with parents dressing their kids up in rainbow and participating in the gay pride parades right?
DeleteTrain up a child in the way he should go. Children can understand what is right and wrong, and children can learn to get involved in standing up for what is right.
DeleteI agree. The reasons for someone seeking an abortion are complex (rape, abusive relationship, medical issues etc) and you really need to understand the reasons behind seeking one before you can make an opinion on it. These issues are too complex for children to understand. I know what the bible states and that is what JB and Michelle believe however I don't feel it is appropriate to get children involved in things they can't quite understand.
DeleteNothing wrong with showing your kids the importance of life at all stages.
DeleteHe isn’t using his kids. They believe in life as well. If you are alive, then someone gave you life. How can you believe it is ok to take an innocent baby’s life? God said in the Bible that He knew you before you were born. He knit your member’s together. He has a purpose for each life!
Delete9:43 If God supposedly knew each of us before we were born, why does he let so many early pregnancies end in miscarriage? Regarding our "purpose in life", IMO it's what we make it. There isn't an invisible entitiy charting the course of our lives. I am pro-choice, for the simple reason that it is the woman that must endure pregnancy and childbirth- neither being risk-free endeavors. If you don't believe in abortion, then don't have one. That's your choice. Other women should have a choice, too, and not be forced to give birth under the threat of a punitive law.
Delete4:00, that’s like saying if you don’t want a slave don’t own one, but I can do what I want with my own life. If I believe slavery is wrong then I’m going to speak out against it, and if I believe abortion is wrong (murder) I’m also going to speak out against it.
DeleteAnon 4:00 👍couldn't have said it better myself! Everyone should be able to make their own choices!
Delete4:00 There is a God. Ever noticed how everyone is so fascinated with "Mother Nature" and think nature knows best? And can't figure out how this or that happens on it's own or how it could exist? Couldn't have happened by accident. No real scientist would say so. Look up the claims of creation scientists and consider them with an open mind. You might be surprised. I challenge you to read the Bible for yourself too. Secondly, abortion is also risky, as well as absolutely damaging psychologically to, I would say, MOST women and even men who go through it. A baby is a separate genetically unique human being.
Delete11:45- It's not saying the same thing at all. You can't compare a conscious, living, breathing human being to a fertilized egg or embryo.
DeleteAnon 4:00, you're right, God did give us the gift of free will, out of His love for us. So we have the freedom to make good or bad choices. God doesn't hate us when we make bad choices, but it does make Him sad. And the good news is that He will forgive us if we repent, because He wants us to see and understand things from His viewpoint.
DeleteIt is also not God's will when things happen, like miscarriages. But sometimes things go wrong for a number of reasons. IF God were to interfere in all of those instances, then there would be no free will at all.
God Bless you.
11:51, a baby at 5 weeks gestation (when you would typically find out that you’re expecting) is much more than “a fertilized egg) And being unconscious does not make you any less of a human. It’s a growing baby at that stage, and is alive (I’d like to know when you think a person magically becomes alive if not at conception) therefore if you have an abortion you are murdering a human. If you’re ok with murder then that’s on you, but don’t try to lessen what an unborn baby is to make abortion more justifiable for you.
DeleteI think it's nice for parents to teach their children that murder is wrong. Go Jim Bob!
Delete@10:09 He could also go one step further and get men to stop adding to this problem.
DeleteNo, I’ve never participated in the March for life. I think each woman should be the sole decider of what’s best for her body and her life.
ReplyDeleteExactly. But abortion is choosing to end someone else's life by poison, dismemberment, etc. She shouldn't have the right to decide what is best for someone else's life. How awful!
DeleteYes, pro-choice all the way
DeleteWho’s life are they marching for exactly.
DeleteI will never attend a march that wants to put restrictions on how doctors treat woman.
DeleteYas!!! Agree completely
DeleteI agree. The people in these marches seem to ignore the fact that women have rights and the woman doesn't need strangers telling her she's too stupid to make her decision based on what is best for HER.
DeleteBut her baby is NOT her body or her life. A baby is its own body, its own heartbeat, and its own life.
DeleteI have never been to a March, but planning to go to the one in Washington on Friday
DeleteSo do I. March for Life is about advocating for human beings who are unable to speak for themselves.
DeleteEach woman can start by deciding how not to get pregnant if she doesn’t want to have a child. That is what is best for her and a baby who is a life at conception.
DeleteI am a woman and I was once inside a woman (my mother) and I am grateful my mom decided to let me live. I am grateful my mom didn’t take it on herself to decide (on my behalf) that what was best for my body and my life was for it to be destroyed and thrown away like a piece of garbage. There is nothing wrong with encouraging people to not destroy innocent lives... the lives of people like you and me who got the chance to live and breathe on this earth. And I was in this predicament when I became pregnant as a teenager. I saw a video when I was in middle school (in health class) of what really happens to babies when they are murdered through abortion. Because of the grace of God allowing me to see reality I never wanted to “get rid of” my kids... no matter how inconvenient it would make my life. I can assure you today... that child is an adult and she is a woman and she would tell you she is very happy and grateful I didn’t make the decision to destroy her body and her life. She is an amazing person today! Having her as a teen was difficult but so is having a child at ANY age. To keep her alive was one of the BEST decisions I could have ever made for my life and my body. Abortion hurts the woman having it done more than people realize or want to admit and the physical, psychological, emotional, and spiritual effects on the woman last a lifetime.
DeleteYES!!!
DeleteThank you! Me too!
DeleteWhat about the life growing inside of her body....? That woman is still a Mother regardless - she is just the mother of her child she chose to murder; I mean, she had the right to decide what was right for HER LIFE right? I guess murder is best for the babies life then? It’s a good thing it was a good time in your mother’s life when you were conceived.
DeleteAgree
DeleteSo ironic that you say that, OP.
DeleteGod is the one who gives life and the only who can take life it back..
DeleteFor HER life yes. But not when it affects another life.
DeleteNeither have I. In my country, a woman's right to make decisions about her own body and health, in consultation with her doctor, is protected by the our constitution. If there was a move to change that, I would be on the streets protesting.
DeletePeriodically, small group of pro-lifers stage protests at busy intersections here. They wave their placards, screaming and yelling, trying to distract drivers. The intersections they pick are usually the busiest, most dangerous ones.
One of these days, there will be serious accident.
A life inside a women’s body is not her life. A baby has his or her own dna and own body. It is up to God to give or take life!
Delete100% agree
DeleteExcept it’s not her body or her life that she is killing when she aborts.
DeleteBut it's not her body... it's a life.
DeleteOP, a baby’s body is not part of your own, so no, you don’t have the right to choose what to do with it.
Delete@8:58- It's wonderful things turned out well with your decision. However, YOU still had a choice in the matter, as should every other woman facing the same situation.
DeleteEveryone seems to care about the fetus before it’s born. What about after it’s born? Who is to care for the child in an abusive home, never knowing love? Who is to care for all the children in foster care, getting bounced from family to family? There are too many children in this world that end up in bad homes and bad family life situations. Everyone cares about the unborn child but no one is caring about the child after birth.
DeleteYea except we don't demand someone to give an organ to save someone else's life. I f one has to use their body to sustain a life if they don't feel like they can or wan t to they don't have to risk their body for so.done else. Birth can be deadly
Delete6:26, birth is very rarely deadly. And organ donation is not the same thing as abortion where you are actively killing someone. You don’t get to murder a baby that you conceived because it’s inconvenient for you.
Delete5:31, saying no one cares for children after they are born is a huge stretch, as there are thousands of foster families in America. And don’t use the foster system to justify abortion, as someone who works with children in these situations it’s very disgusting to hear. As horrible as the situation is, these children are not better off dead, and you implying that is disgusting.
DeleteThe babies body is connected to her body, and would not survive long enough to be born without her body... if it comes down to risking the mothers life or taking the baby, then the mother should die...? What if she has more young children at home and the father passed away, she should still keep the baby that will end her life leaving her children with no parents... a woman should be able to make her own choices!
DeletePeople DO care about children in abusive homes and foster care. I certainly do, and am doing something about at least one child too. If everyone did a little what a difference it would make!
DeleteBirth is rarely deadly nowadays, but abortion can also harm a woman and even make them unable to have a child, is linked to breast cancer, etc. But even worse, MANY people, men and women, who go through abortion, have terrible long term psychological damage!!
Delete@8:58 Keeping an unwanted child or placing it for adoption can also have long-lasting emotional consequences. My aunt placed a child for adoption sixty years ago and she was overcome with grief until the day she died. I have an adult adopted daughter who carries with her the long lasting burden of feeling abandonded by her birth mother. The reality is that the options available to a woman facing an unwanted pregnancy are all crummy. I can't think of any woman who would relish the idea of having to make a decision between any of them. However, it should be her decision and hers alone.
DeleteAnonymous 8:29AM Life in itself is difficult and full of choices, every.single.day. And each one of those choices has a consequence. However, it is NEVER okay to end a person’s life. Is it a choice? OF COURSE. People murder other people every day. But is it RIGHT? No way. Sometimes we have to jump outside our narrow view of emotions and see things for what they are... killing unborn babies will NEVER be right. It will NEVER be okay. It was NEVER meant to be a “normal thing” for a woman to murder the life growing inside of herself... NO MATTER what the situation may be. Bring all the excuses and reasonings and sob stories you want... it will never be okay to murder babies. No matter how much you want things your way and want your life “perfect”.
Delete8:29, when you’re killing another person, no, it should not be your choice and your choice alone. Also, adoption has changed so much in America, even over just the last decade to be more pro birth mother and pro child, so that the outcome is not just favorable for the adoptive parents. I’m sorry that your daughter feels the way she does, maybe you need to find more ways to be supportive of her, but implying that it would be better that children in her situation were never born is horrible to say.
Delete7:07, no one here is talking about a situation where the mother is going to die. That is very rarely the reason a woman is looking to get an abortion and you know it, and does everyone who tries to use that as their weak defense of abortion.
Delete@11:43...I work in an under privileged school district. Where families have kids to get more food stamps and more money from the government. Kids bounced around in foster care and then end up in juvenile because they don’t have good role models or anyone that cares about them. Kids that their only meals of the day are the breakfast and lunch the school provides. More than 80% of our students are low income. About 75% come from families where the family could care less about the child and school is a daycare service for that child. Yes, I am sure there are good foster families out there but not every family is a good family. And just because someone can have a child doesn’t mean they should...especially if they can’t provide a loving environment for that child. Too many kids end up in the system. Too many kids In gangs, too many kids selling drugs. No parental involvement. What about these kids? If a child is going to be brought up in that environment I feel a woman should be allowed to make that choice. Of course people want to adopt...but they want babies from families that don’t have socio-economic issues. They want babies from women that aren’t on drugs, don’t have family members in jail, etc. Very few children in that type of environment get out and make something of themselves. So yes, allow a woman to choose. Banning abortions won’t stop them....they will still happen illegally. No one is fighting for that first grader with learning issues and no love at home. Fight for the unborn and then walk away and let it be someone else’s problem.
Delete@8:00 Thank you for your post. You are so right.
DeleteMany of these pro-lifers have not walked in the shoes of the poor and disadvantaged.
What bothers me the most about pro-lifers that many are against birth control. Where are the protests to provide free and easy access to birth control for the poor and disadvantage? Where are the protests for more better school programs; food programs for the youth.... They are silent.
The foster system is over-burdened and it is not the answer to the problems.
@3:07 But that's the very reason why this procedure must remain legal and available, because there ARE women who need it to save their lives. How'd you like to need medical treatment but be told sorry, no can do, because people were abusing it so we outlawed it across the board? Medicine can't do that.
Delete8:00, so what you’re saying is that it would be better for those children to be aborted and never born? How do you not see how disgusting that is?
DeleteIf the baby were the woman's body, they would have the same DNA. Instead, they have unique DNA -- unique bodies.
DeleteAnonymous @ 8:00PM I commend you for working with the children you are working with, no doubt. However, to claim that murdering babies is a way to solve the worlds poverty and orphan issues is absurd. Two wrongs don’t make a right. The reason the world is in the condition it is in has nothing to do with people having children. It has to do with a world that has turned away from God and tried to follow other ways. Outcome? Poverty, sickness, depravity, war, diseases, hate, murder, rape, rage, bitterness, fraud, deceit, jealousy, anger, and every other type of negative thing you could ever think of. This is a result of sin, period. No matter what religion people claim to be a part of... the truth that a world turned against God suffers the wrath the world (satan) has to offer will never change. And there will continue to be heated and unending and exhausting debates/fights/discussions like these until Jesus returns. There is an answer and it is a choice to make. The most important choice anyone can make in their entire lives. God sent Jesus to die for all of the things talked about in this post discussion. He came to overcome this world for us so that we have a choice to receive that truth and LIVE and have hope for what is to come or to reject that truth and continue to run in circles full of misery, dread, and hopelessness. The reason many of those families are in the position they are in is due to their own bad choices or that of their families. Wrong decisions breed chaos and difficult lives. And the solution is not to continue making horrible choices by murdering babies. How would anyone know what that child is destined to do in this world? That very same baby could be the answer to the mothers problems and needs. God works in amazing ways and I was that underprivileged child on food stamps who grew up to make wrong choices and ended up pregnant in high school. However, by the grace of God, I refused to make an even bigger mistake and mess. I decided to not murder my baby and God worked through that child to save me from a life full of hell and heartbreak. He worked through that baby to give me a sense of purpose and a reason to keep living day to day. And when I accepted Jesus into my heart and chose to believe what He did for me... my life didn’t automatically become problem-free but God turned my nightmares into a beautiful life. There is hope beyond an “unwanted pregnancy”. Hope for the mother AND for the person she has been blessed to carry inside of her. Murdering that person and deciding they should never have a chance at life is not the answer. Never will be.
DeleteDon't like abortion...don't have one! It's that simple. Don't you dare try to take away women's rights!
ReplyDeleteIt’s not a right to commit murder.
DeleteMurder is no one’s right! It is illegal just as abortion should be! If you don’t want to get pregnant, don’t have sexual relations or take the pill or some other form of birth control.
DeleteThey used to say, 'Don't like slavery, don't "own" any. But don't interfere with me 'owning" slaves. Slavery was absolutely wrong, and killing people before they are born (or anytime) is absolutely wrong. Pray for the day when this truth is universally recognized.
DeleteYes. My family has attended the one in DC for the last 7 years and we will be attending this one as well. I hope for the day we no longer have to.
ReplyDeleteYes I have after suffering terribly from the lies of Planned Parenthood and doing much research on what really happens in an abortion.
ReplyDeleteOn a different subject, the rumors can stop about Jana being linked to NFL's Tim Tebow. He married Miss Universe 2017 today, in South Africa. He is off the market.
ReplyDeleteI have seen Jana/Tim Tebow rumors for years!
Yes....and they are an awesome couple. May God bless their marriage.
DeleteThey both have statements a long time ago setting this straight 🙄
DeleteHow wonderful that JB's teaching his kids about the great worth of every human being, right from conception. I applaud him.
ReplyDeleteGiven that the pro-abortionists have no qualms about bringing children to their marches or protests, why shouldn’t pro-lifers bring children to their marches or protests?
ReplyDeleteI'd rather have my kid help save babies than kill them.
DeleteI'd rather no children at either March.
DeleteThey are all here because their parents are pro life. There is no age limit for being pro life.
ReplyDeleteI haven’t but I want to someday. Abortion is murder !
ReplyDeleteMe too!
DeleteWe must remember the baby is not part of her body. He/she has unique DNA. Bless the Duggars for being voices for the voiceless.
ReplyDeleteSuch a beautiful, inspirational family. Such courage to stand up boldly and proudly for the truth. They know that there will be haters, but they stand tall regardless. I pray for the faith and strength that the Duggars show every day. God Bless them all!
ReplyDeleteI would love to join a March for Life, and think that both children and adults should participate in this beautiful, peaceful demonstration for the natural right of all people to LIFE. It’s never too early to be concerned about the completely innocent and voiceless.
ReplyDeleteI've never done a March for Life, but I did attend the March for Our Lives back in 2018 for gun control.
ReplyDeleteGood for the Duggars, giving a voice to the voiceless. I marched in D.C. January 2017. There's nothing selfish about the March for Life and those attending go as friends. It's one day in the year when brotherly love marches through the streets of our capitol.
ReplyDeleteThere are lots of united marches in Washington for different causes. This march is not unique in that sense.
DeleteI'm uncomfortable with the term "used". None of us know the conversations that took place between the parents and children.
ReplyDeleteI have not joined one of the marches but its a noble thing people do and its fine to want innocent babies to be born. I; myself am Pro-choice in that I believe all women have the choice to choose for their own bodies (as long as they are capable to decide) and abortion ONLY in extreme cases. BTW, Jordyn is looking more like Jim Bob while i never felt she looked like mom or dad til now.
ReplyDeleteBut having an abortion isn’t killing you, it’s killing a baby, so you aren’t making a decision for your own body.
DeleteAs soon as the cells come together, a complete, separate, unique individual person is formed who will never exist again on this earth.
DeleteI agree with both of you people, but the women that are the hosts of the new humans, their bodies their choice... All Humans have free will
DeleteSuz, the woman is not the one who is dying in the process of abortion though, therefore while yes, she has free will, it is not an action that should be legal.
DeleteSo happy they are doing this. America has more extreme pro abortion laws than many in liberal European countries. You can kill a baby up until birth in this country and it's not done to just save the mother. Those that will say this is not true are not informed. It happens. It's horrible.
ReplyDeleteNo, I have helped women struggling with feeding their kids abd ebcouraged them not to give up. Abortion is complex, so often women don't have the toolsto keep the baby or care for the baby. I try to help women who have chosen to keep their baby. To truly reduce abortions, women need daily assistance with the baby.
ReplyDeleteIf you can’t care for your baby or don’t want your baby, adoption is also on option before abortion.
Delete@3:50- That's not news. Placing a child for adoption still requires a woman to endure pregnancy and give birth. It alters her body, poses risks, and influences her ability to earn a living and possibly care for other children. No woman should be forced to keep an unwanted child or place it for adoption.
DeleteAnon 3:50. the "adoption solution". So easy. However, in my state (Kentucky) we have over 10,000 children in foster care needing to be adopted. So we need MORE wanted children? Why?
Delete8:36, babies are extremely easy to place for adoption, there are around 31 waiting parents for every baby that is placed for adoption. Older children are harder to place for adoption, but that does not mean that it’s ok to murder babies in their place.
DeleteGod is the one who gives life, and he is the only who take it back. not humans!
ReplyDeleteUm, if a person kills someone, they still took their life, I’m not sure what point you’re trying to drive across here.
DeleteGod is the one who gives life, and he is the only who take it back. not humans!
ReplyDeleteSara, I’m assuming by your comment that you believe the death penalty is also wrong. Good for you!
DeleteSara should then also stand for gun control.
DeleteGod is actually the one who instituted capital punishment.
Delete12:26, are you trying to compare an innocent baby to say, someone who raped/murdered a three year old? That happened recently in my town, and if justice is served that man will receive the death penalty.
DeleteI'm glad they're marching for life. My mom and dad watched me when I was born at 1 lb. 10 oz's trying to survive. She could not understand why women would want an abortion if nothing was wrong.
ReplyDeleteIt is never right and it is never what's best for one person, to end the life of another.
ReplyDeletePsalm 139:13-14 ESV
ReplyDeleteFor you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother's womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well.
Anon 7:10 I love those scriptures you posted. They are a beautiful reminder that even in the womb God is always watching and involved in our life. I googled 21 week old baby in the womb holds Doctors finger as it was being operated on to correct spina bifida (which was a successful operation) and although full term is 39 weeks old, yet this baby at 21 weeks old found comfort holding the Doctors finger as he was being operated on. I thought of the scriptures you posted as I looked at his tiny hand and was over joyed at thought of how precious life is from the very beginning of our life to the very end.
DeleteHow do you explain these verses then?
DeleteNumbers 5:11-31
2 Kings 8:12
2 Kings 15:16
Hosea 13:16
There would be far fewer abortions if these "right to life" people would work WITH Planned Parenthood to prevent unwanted pregnancies instead of relentlessly attacking PP. But that will never happen. Sigh.
ReplyDeleteSo True! Prevention and planning is The key!
DeleteActually planned parenthood makes it's main money from abortions. That's what they are all about. Research it.
DeleteI agree that people should research the entire history of planned parenhood and Margaret Sanger.
DeleteI personally think Jordyn, Johanna and Jennifer should be with people their own age and not an event like this. I don't think having people who are preteens to young teens is a good thing because they are at a time of their lives that they should be at a senior center playing games, singing, at a mall shopping.
ReplyDeleteI don't know, sounds like a good educational experience to me. They are seeing adults modeling standing up for what they believe in.
DeleteTo Anon 8:18 am -- I never wanted to hang out at a mall. Just because you enjoyed that as a teen doesn't mean that someone else should.
Delete@3:52PM Using your example, there are other marches showing that same model of standing up for what you believe in, but the Duggars would never go to most of those marches. This is children being initiated into their parents' beliefs, on purpose. The kids are old enough to start making their own decisions, without influence. They should be shown that the rest of the world and other ideas are not that bad.
DeleteThey’re all old enough to know what an abortion is so there’s really no reason that they can’t be there. And this is one day out of their year, it’s not stealing away from them going to the mall, singing, hanging out with friends, etc.
DeleteAnd no I have never been nor will I ever be at a march like this.
ReplyDeleteI am pro-choice, so no, I do not agree with the Duggars' stance against abortion. Women are capable of making their own decisions about continuing a pregnancy, without interference from the government.
ReplyDeleteIt’s not about being capable to make a decision, it’s about what is ok and what’s not. Murdering a baby being it’s life is inconvenient to you is wrong, plain and simple.
DeleteIt's not about women being capable, it's about saying that abortion is taking the life of another person besides the mother.
DeleteOccasionally a woman doesn't realize she was pregnant until she gives birth. Probably some of them also feel it's inconvenient. That doesn't mean they can kill the baby. They have the choice to give it up for adoption.
DeleteWe wonder why our youth are killing each other, we wonder why suicide among the youth is at an all time high, we wonder why our youth show such blatant disrespect for authority, we wonder why there are mass school shootings. Well people look no further then the adults in their society. When you can reach into the womb of their mothers and rip their siblings out in pieces as the baby silently screams in pain, well don't expect our youth to see life any different then you do. Shameful time we live in!!!
DeleteMr. Duggar isn't "using" his children but instilling values, that is, a right to life! Babies who are unable to speak for themselves, their bodies & their life! Abortion stops a beating ❤!
ReplyDeleteI do not agree with abortion but I do realize not everyone believes the same way!! What I absolutely feel is that abortion at all stages is wrong!! Up to the due date is murder, plain and simple. Also, too many use abortion as a form of birth control. That is wrong. If you don’t learn after the first abortion then you are lazy. Use double birth control- you and him- but don’t keep aborting.
ReplyDeleteThis is a subject I totally disagree with the Duggar’s on. Iv seen too much pain & anxiety with babies carried to term that have no chance of survival, purely because parents won’t terminate on religious grounds. Some of these babies suffer greatly due to the trauma of birth & the parents are obviously devastated with the loss of a still born. I’m sorry Jim Bob but I don’t think you have a clue about the real world where young underage girls & disabled girls are raped & abused, yet you still think they should be forced to carry their baby. You live in a bubble & I really feel his young daughters should not be dragged along to pro life marches. Let these young girls make their own decisions later in life. They should not be subjected to such things at their age. I had strong anti abortion views myself for years growing up, & into my mid 20s, then I changed my opinion totally due to a very sad case I shall not go into now. I also lived in Ireland for years where abortion was a crime & you had young women travelling to England to have their pregnancies terminated. By outlawing abortion it doesn’t stop women still seeking them, they simply get them from unscrupulous women, who are untrained & unskilled & either mutilate them so badly they cannot ever conceive again, or worse cause such devastation & infection that sepsis sets in & these young women die.
ReplyDeleteThank you, Fuzzyfret!
DeleteLaws could be changed to where an abortion could only be had in the instance of rape, definite terminal pregnancy, or in cases where the mother will die and the baby is not at a viable age, otherwise there is no reason for an abortion. If you don’t want your baby that’s fine, you can place them for adoption, but killing them simply because they are an inconvenience to you is just wrong.
DeleteWell said Fuzzyferet!
Deleteanon 3:59- Why should you, or anyone, decide for someone else whether or not their reasons to seek an abortion are valid or not? You have no idea what is behind this decision that other women make. Contrary to what you believe, the issue is not all black and white, or simiply a matter of a pregnancy being "inconvenient". Quite frankly, it's none of your business, any more than it's my business how many children you decide to bring into the world or why you have them.
Delete9:55 You might be surprised at how often children are killed out of convenience. By the way, when the government says "for health reasons" that includes mental health, which basically can include anything you want it to.
DeleteLess than 0.5% of abortions are performed because of rape. 67% of abortions are performed simply because someone doesn't want the child because it's not convenient. Even if we just prevented that 67% from happening, we could save nearly 600,000 children. In some states you can get an abortion even up to 24 weeks. Age of viability is 20-21 weeks. Take a look at any 20 week old baby in NICU-it is a HUMAN, and has a beating heart, can move, and feel pain long before that. How is it ever a "woman's choice" to intentionally stop someone else's heart? If a person murders a pregnant woman, it can be considered a double murder. Yet that same woman in many cases can murder it herself and it's considered her "right." Sickening.
Delete9:55, it actually is my business, if I knew my neighbors were abusing their children I would speak out against it, just as I will speak out against the murder of babies who can’t speak for themselves and are defenseless. And yes, it is a very black and white matter, murder is wrong, period. If you consented to having sex then you knew becoming pregnant was a possibility, so unless you are going to die without receiving an abortion you don’t have to right to one. It’s very easy to wrap your head around when you don’t value your own comfort over someone else’s life.
DeleteThere are sad cases, but these are the exception, not the rule. And rape victims can get a lot of comfort from their babies, instead of being tortured with the added pain of abortion on top of the pain of being raped. I've learned this from actual rape victims online. It's not the baby's fault that the father was a criminal. It's still just as much a baby with a right to live.
DeleteThank you Fuzzyferet.
DeleteI appreciate Fuzzyferet's perspective from her medical background, but I fail to see how a baby would suffer more from going through the birth process than from saline poisoning, dismemberment, or any other abortion method. News is just out that unborn babies may be able to feel pain as early as 12-13 weeks in utero.
Delete@8:37 Really? How do you know?
Delete3:25, very good point. Why should an innocent baby get the death penalty for the crime of his or her father?
Delete@3:25 I would not want to be reminded of a horribly traumatic event every time I looked at the child I was forced to have. You must understand that women can feel that way, too.
DeleteAnon 12:24 Thank you and well said.
DeleteI have to agree with Jim Bob, life begins after conception, I can't see taking the life of a defenceless child.
ReplyDelete11:15 Unfortunately, defenseless children who are born unwanted are often raised in poverty and abuse. Maybe people need to organize a second march to fight that.
DeletePeople who want children can't have, people who don't want children have them.
DeleteJennifer looks a lot like Jana, and Johanna like joy-anna
ReplyDeleteYes!! Way to go Duggars! Thank-you for supporting women and their unborn children!
ReplyDeleteI'd march in a gun control rally because I am an advocate of trying to make this world safer for the living, breathing human beings already born into this world.
ReplyDeleteMy baby was still just as much a human baby inside me as outside of me! Why not march against tearing a helpless infant apart? Someone needs to be a voice for these little ones that can't express themselves yet.
DeleteKudos to the Duggars for their support of the cause.
ReplyDeleteJoan,Marion and Marilyn
The Supreme Court made their 1973 decision regarding abortion based on our inherent right to privacy, that the government cannot interfere with nor legislate
ReplyDeletethe outcome of a woman's pregnancy. If you believe life begins at the moment of conception and that a newly feritlized egg should have all the rights and consideration of a living breathing human being, do you really want the government to possibly investigate the circumstances of every miscarriage? If abortion were criminalized, rich women would still be able to afford to leave the country for a procedure. Anyone else would seek other desperate, but unsafe measures. How is this ok? This is how it was 50 years ago. Banning abortion won't end it. It might make some people feel better by putting it back underground in a shroud of secrecy and risk- Out of sight-out of mind kind of mentality.
Out of sight out of mind, exactly. That’s what abortion is. Women can’t see what they’re doing to the life inside of them, so it doesn’t seem so bad. What if the baby/fetus whatever you want to call it, at whatever stage, is taken out of the women alive and then is poisoned or dismembered right in front of her eyes. Seems cruel? It is. Either way.
DeleteI am positive that the majority of women would not seek unsafe procedures, but rather give the baby up to adoption if they cannot care for the baby themselves. I also don't think the government would ever become so zealous for babies' lives that they would start investigating miscarriages. It's not about putting it out of sight, but about protecting at least the majority of helpless victims who cannot protect themselves. Can all murders be stopped? No, but at least we can make it harder.
Delete7:44- But your ok with desperate women, who couldn’t afford to leave the country for an abortion, resorting to unsafe medical procedures? That’s how things were in this country before 1973. My own grandmother nearly died from a self-induced abortion during the Depression years.
DeleteAbortion is still wrong whether done in a back alley or an abortion clinic. Just because women do it out of desperation doesn't make it right.
DeleteThere are women that have been hurt, mutilated or died at the hands of an abortionist, during a legal abortion. I’m sorry that your grandmother was so desperate that she felt that was what she had to do. That’s why I feel that we need to expect more out of ourselves and of our culture. To give each other love and support and say, YES! You can do this. You can be an amazing mother or father. Life is not easy, I’m not sure it’s even supposed to be. But we can what is good and right and teach our children that. A clear conscience is a beautiful thing also
Delete6:15, if you choose to murder someone there are going to be consequences for that.
Delete11:14- I'm afraid you think we live in a perfect world, where everyone is capapble of being a good parent. That's not reality. No amount of cheering someone on can turn them into an amazing mother or father.
DeleteI believe the majority of pro life Americans may also be (conservative) religious, mostly Christians, if I'm not mistaken. I understand that from their point of view, life is considered a God given gift. The Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away. And there's nothing wrong with that.
ReplyDeleteHowever. Not all have the same belief as you. Far from it. While most conservative religious groups and individuals preach about their right to religious freedom and the right to live accordingly to their beliefs, they also seem to want to force their own beliefs upon others when it comes to the matter of abortion. This is quite problematic and also highlights why religion and politics is better left unmixed.
If you don't believe in abortion and you fall pregnant, you naturally choose to go through with your pregnancy. That is in accordance with your beliefs. Someone else may not share your beliefs. Why should they be forced, by law even, to abide by yours? Are (conservative) Christians in the US deemed correct by default in all matters of legislation? If so, does the US really have freedom of religion and the US citizens have the freedom to live accordingly to their beliefs?
In regards to setting a limit for when it is too late to seek an abortion, it may very well need a debate. Where I live, that limit is currently at 12 weeks. Most women who terminates their pregnancies here, and the abortion rates have declined for years here too, happens well before week 12. Is that the same case in the US? What about doing something about what causes unplanned pregnancies instead of banning abortion completely?
I sadly think the pro life/pro choice debates, marches, demonstrations and what not that's going on in the US only serve to further polarize and alienate the groups from each other. It paints a very black and white picture on a matter that is far from black and white. It puts each of the sides in the debate in a position of us versus them. That, in the long run, might be more harmful than it looks.
It has nothing to do with religion, what it really boils down to is when you think a person becomes a person. You don’t have to be a Christian or part of any other religious group to believe that life begins at conception. We all know that murder is wrong, so if a baby becomes a person the moment they are conceived then killing them is wrong, and there’s no way to beat around that.
DeleteYou might be right about the polarization. But.. first of all, laws in Western cultures are, believe it or not, originally stemming from a fear of God and/or from the Bible. According to the law, killing someone is wrong. Now people are trying to decide what a person is... is a fetus a person? Is an old person who can’t care for himself a person? What about a new-born baby that isn't wanted? (This is truly a debate question). Maybe in the future, people who realize it's too hard to take care of their three-month old baby will be able to kill them too. I'm being facetious, but who knows really. So the law needs to decide what a human being is. Actually science backs it up that a person is a person at the moment of conception. There’s not much reason for religion here. There is a new specific set of genes formed when the sperm and egg come together that is totally separate from the mother. A completely new individual. Should the law protect that individual? Especially considering that he or she is helpless to protect himself? Secondly, abortion methods are pretty horrible. Look it up if you're interested. And it cannot be proven when a baby can start feeling pain and fear. I dare to say it might be a lot earlier than people think. Abby Johnson would sure agree with that. Thirdly, and on a side note, I think there's a lot being done to prevent unplanned pregnancies. Sometimes the zeal goes overboard in my opinion. Kindergarten children do not need to learn about sex and practice cuddling for instance to prepare them for not getting pregnant - if that's the goal of early sex education? But that’s another topic.
DeleteExcellent post. Here, there are no abortion laws. It is considered a medical issue, between a woman and her doctor. Even with no laws, late term abortions are only in very rare cases. The vast majority are medical, before 10 weeks.
DeleteOur abortion rates have been decreasing, each year, since abortion laws were found to be unconstitutional in the 80s.
Our right to freedom of religion also implies freedom from religion. The government is secular.
@5:43 Abortion restrictions vary from state to state. The Bible belt states tend to be the most restrictive and make it difficult to obtain a legal abortion. New York recently passed a bill that removes abortion from the state's penal code. The new law codifies the right to an abortion until 24 weeks, and allows abortion in the third trimester if the pregnant woman's life or health is at risk, or if there is a fetal abnormality. (This was done primarily to address the possibility of a majority conserative Supreme Court overturning Roe v Wade in the future.) BTW, I agree with everything you say, especially that certain religious beliefs should not be mixed with setting public policy.
Delete7:48 Just how far do you want society to go with protecting every fertilized egg or embryo?
Delete@7:38 Sex education DOES NOT teach kindergarten to cuddle and prepare them for sex. Really? Have you actually read the sex education curriculum?
DeleteEarly sex education teaches children the correct name of the parts of the body. It teaches them the difference between "good" and "bad" touches and to tell a trusted adult if they are being subjected to touches that make them uncomfortable. Ever heard of child abuse?
Two cents from this senior citzen: The pro-life movement seeks to force their moral beliefs on others - grounded in their own religion or personal philosophy. The pro-choice movement doesn't make claims on the morality of abortion - we leave that as an individual choice for every woman faced with an unwanted pregnancy. If they feel abortion is wrong and they want to give their child up for adoption, or keep it, we will support their decision. Making abortion illegal won't stop abortions from happening, it will only stop them from being safe. 43% of abortions worldwide are illegal. Changing laws doesn't solve the problem, making contraception available and affordable does. Can anyone really believe that abortion would even be an issue if men had to face the possibility of giving birth to and raising a child because of one night of failed contraception? I'm pro-choice because it's the only option that isn't poisoned with misogyny.
ReplyDeleteI would dare say that the vast majority of pro-lifers are pro-baby and pro-women. Abortion can affect women negatively in their bodies, minds, and spirits.
DeleteFrom another senior citizen I have so say I totally agree. Every woman has to decide for herself what is right for her. Abortions will still happen whether legal or not, so they must remain safe. It's not up to the government to decide
Delete8:55, it has nothing to do with misogyny, and everything to do with the fact that a baby is a human being, and that we as a country believe that murder is wrong. So how is legal to murder a baby just become it is not yet born?
DeleteAnon 855, nobody expects that abortions would ever stop completely (although that would be nice). The point is more about the message that it would send if it were illegal. And that message is that we, as a nation, care about human life.
DeleteIf alcohol and certain drugs (like inhalants) were illegal, people would still use them. Many people use drugs that are illegal, but that doesn't mean that we should legalize them. What kind of message would that send?
What Pro-Lifers really want is for young people to be educated about the reality of abortion. And no, they are not educated; because if they were, then they wouldn't be having them. If people really understood that even a very young embryo can and does feel the pain of abortion, then I am convinced, that most of them would not choose to abort.
After reading these posts, it is obvious to me how sadly uneducated many people are with regards to human development. This is all stuff that should be taught in schools, but isn't. Kids need to be taught about the reality of abortion. And they need to be educated about the joy of having respect for themselves and their bodies, and about the dignity and joy that comes with waiting until marriage before having sex. And the consequences of not waiting.
I wish that someone had talked to me about these things.
9:38- You do realize that it isn't just unmarried women having abortions. Married women have them, too.
DeleteAnon 12:08 in answer to your question: Yes, I do realize that unmarried women and married women alike have abortions. My original post still stands, but thank you for your response to my post. God Bless.:)
DeleteMy opinion is abortion is a womens choice. Children like the Duggars are having this drilled into them its wrong . The kids should be playing with friends not going to a march. Let kids be kids. Should a women choose to abort we dont have any ideas the reason, so let not judge HER please . She has to answer to her God when the time comes. Freedom of choice is why its called free. Ledabeth
ReplyDeleteAll of the Duggar kids are old enough to understand what abortion is and know that murdering someone is wrong. And letting a woman have an abortion and then answer to God for it later does not save the baby’s life, so no, I will no and always speak out against abortion and do anything in my power to make it illegal in America.
DeleteMotherhood and fatherhood is beautiful, hard, rewarding and sanctifying. Pro choice is choosing fear. We’re all in the same boat and need to build each other up and help each other see our dignity as men and women and that life is meaningful.
ReplyDeleteI say a woman is afraid no matter what option she chooses. None of the choices are anything but fear-inducing when facing an unwanted pregnancy.
DeleteOf course it’s scary. But you don’t have to give in to the fear, and say, no, I can’t or don’t want to do this. Lots of things that are good for us, can be fear inducing- starting college, going out for a new job, starting a business, dating, getting married. Society tells women that they can do anything. But not motherhood- it’s too hard, or it’ll ruin your career or it’s beneath us. Motherhood and fatherhood is the hardest job and the most honorable. I truly believe it enhances our lives, not takes it away
DeleteOnce again the contentious issue of abortion rears its head. No amount of debate will change people's strongly held views. However, I will point out that the major objections to abortion are based on religious belief regarding life. As a nation that values religious freedom, I think we need to refrain from forcing our religious beliefs on others who don't share our view of God and life.
ReplyDeleteI disagree. I know of at least one prominent person (a former doctor who describes the process of abortion) who is not religious. I would dare to say that a lot of the people making the underground planned parenthood videos are also not religious. Children's lives don't have to be a religious issue.
DeleteExactly, 9:26. We see examples on this very blog of people forgetting that their religion is not for everyone, and under the US constitution can't legally be. Worship how you want on your day of the week to do that, but leave all religion out of politics or there is going to be major contention.
Delete9:26, our nation also has decided that murder is wrong, therefore it really comes down to when you believe a person becomes a person. You don’t have to be a Christian to believe life begins at conception.
Delete11:29, that isn't possible. Abortion was illegal until Roe v. Wade because it was considered murder, and the only reason it was overturned was that certain parties wanted it overturned, not that in their hearts they believed it was not taking a life. They just wanted that right. The Judeo-Christian ethic is the basis for laws against murder, theft, etc. If you are going to undo that, you have to make murder, theft, fraud and all other forms of dishonesty, etc. legal.
Delete9:26 it's not a religious stance, it's a moral one. The fact that most pro-lifers are Christian is a normal consequence of trying to make a sound, moral choice. To be more Christ-like, if you will. You are right, it is not merely a coincidence that many pro-lifers are Christian, just as it is not a coincidence that many people who oppose violence in general are Christian. Would you say to those individuals that their quest for non-violence is a religious quest or a moral one?
DeleteGod Bless
I'm pro choice. But I respect people who have a different opinion. So no, I have never walked in a pro life walk and I don't plan on walking in one.
ReplyDeleteSince carrying a pregnancy to term and giving birth profoundly affects a woman for the rest of her life, I find the assertion by pro life advocates that it's "not about HER body" troubling. I get the uneasy feeling that they're so enamored of the fetus that the woman doesn't really matter to them.
ReplyDeleteYes! It's as if the woman is simply a vessel, a means to an end.
Delete12:23, personally I value a baby’s life over a woman’s comfort. If you dont want to be pregnant don’t sleep with anyone.
Delete1:29 PM: it's not about "woman's comfort". Pregnancy is a huge stress on woman's body, it makes a woman not be able to do many things, work, focus. A woman loses a lot of abilities during these 9 months, and her whole health could be affected for the rest of her life.
DeleteWomen matter!
I recently read Margaret Sangers Autobiography. Well, some of it, not all of it. She has an interesting story, bit it is sad to see what conclusions she comes to. She grew up in an irish family in Corning, NY. But her father was a "free thinker" and didn't teach his kids any religion, not even Catholicism. He encouraged them to form their own beliefs. Margaret eventually became an RN, and helped deliver babies on the Lower East side tenements in Manhattan. That's when she started advocating for birth control, and then abortion.
ReplyDeleteDid it talk about her promoting abortion as a way to reduce the population of blacks? My understanding is that she was into eugenics.
DeleteYou think birth control was a bad thing? I'm not sure what your point is.
DeleteWhy don't you read her entire autobiography? I think that would give you a better perspective on her. Also, I will point out that PP's current mission and goals are different than Sanger's were. They really aren't her evil offspring.
DeleteMargaret was ahead of her time and has helped generations of women!
DeleteThose kids have no business being there. There should be an 18 yr old age limit at this type thing. Murder or abortions is definitely not subject for children.
ReplyDeleteYet they allow children under 18 to get abortions without parental consent in some states.
DeleteUnfortunately, it's a fact in our culture, and there are young girls having abortions (12, 13, 14 year olds). Part of being a parent is passing values down to your children. Public school kids are being taught very graphic things at the ages of the Duggars girls. Are you against that too?
DeleteYou don’t have to be 18 to speak out against murder.
DeleteSo there should be a 18 year old age limit at a pro life rally, but girls under 18 can get an abortion without parental permission?
DeleteTo 712:33 and :50 - This is the OP - I never said those things. Please do not put words in other people's mouths.
DeleteI am so honored and humbled to fight on the side of Pro-Life with the Duggars! My two teenage sons and I will march in D.C. for the first time this year.
ReplyDelete#MakeAmericaProLifeAgain
I have a question for pro-lifers, one I haven't heard discussed yet. Would you support pregnant women from other countries coming to our country (the US) instead of having abortions in their home countries, so their babies could be born as American citizens and perhaps be put into the American adoption system? Does being pro-life stop at a border?
ReplyDeleteThat’s a silly question. Pro life has nothing to do with borders! The value of the life is not less because they were not conceived in the United States. So no, I personally wouldn’t want the baby to be aborted no matter what the location of conception was. Also, are you assuming all pro lifers are conservative? And just a note on that.. conservatives are not against people coming to America.. we just want them to come LEGALLY! Nothing wrong with that! Many other countries have rules about coming into their countries legally too.
DeleteI find this whole pro-life march discussion lacking one obvious factor. Where is the male responsibility? You can't deny that's part of this problem. Instead of teaching our daughters not to have abortions, how about teaching our sons not to be irresponsible?
ReplyDelete