Wednesday, March 14, 2012
35 comments:
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I agree with everything she said, and would like to add another thought. The modern-American practice of moving out of our parents' home, just because we've reached a certain age, has created a huge demand for new housing - mostly apartment complexes. We need to think about how much this "progress" is taxing our environment. Think of what a difference it would make if most young adults continued to live at home (and be PRODUCTIVE members of their families), until it was truly necessary to move out. There would be more wide, open, green spaces and less run-off water being forced into existing neighborhoods. Also, the practice of living with other people, and having to show consideration on a daily basis, would lead to more people who are givers rather than takers.
ReplyDeleteWell said
DeleteThe world as a whole is definitely not overpopulated as Michelle's comparison with Jacksonville also showed. Nevertheless overpopulation does occur locally in some urban areas of Asia, Africa and even Europe - but actually you might argue that this is in fact not a problem of a high birth rate but rather a problem of fair distribution of water, food, living space, jobs and so on ...
ReplyDeleteAll the same one can definitely not blame the Duggars for contributing to overpopulation and it always depends on where you are living, too: Beautiful Arkansas is certainly not overpopulated!! :)
By the way Duggars: You would be more than welcome here in Germany - the 7th child of a family often gets a state representative (like the president!) as his godfather when being baptized to honor that high number of kids in the family! Birth rate in Germany is extremely low.
Best wishes from around the globe!
Lisa G - I agree! Actually we really changed our thinking on this due to the Duggars. We have been encouraging our teenage children to plan on living at home at long as they want/need to, and also to plan on commuting to college rather than move out. It seems incredibly silly to have a big home and then have 3 of the 5 people living in it move out to separate apartments! We have been blessed by the Duggars and their encouragement via their show. They have really changed our hearts.
ReplyDeleteI really love what Michelle said here! It's so true!
ReplyDeleteWhile I do believe in intelligent family planning, I also believe in being insync with God's plan for your life and that God has the ultimate decision (including how many children a couple will have no matter how much birth control or how careful they are) I do believe we need to look much more at our human concuption. If we only took from the earth what we "need", there would still be plenty for the 7 billion people on the planet and the animal population. I say that from both a careful scientific view and a faith view.
ReplyDeleteWhile I very much appreciate the Duggars' emphasis on buying used items and the environmental impact that can have, Michelle side-steps the main thrust of most overpopulation arguments.
ReplyDeleteOverpopulation isn't a concern about not being able to find room to put human beings - it's a concern about the resources those human beings use. While humans themselves are compact, the amount of arable land required for them to survive is not. You need lots of space to grow crops, raise livestock, dispose of trash, acquire potable water, and generate energy to feed and support each individual person. Overpopulation alarmists aren't concerned with all of us humans fitting into a space like Jacksonville - they're concerned about the Earth's ability to produce the materiel needed to support our growing numbers.
We often don't think about this in the States because we live in a resource-rich environment for agriculture and livestock and are rich enough (compared to the rest of the world) to import whatever else is needed. That is not true of huge swaths of the planet. We can disagree about the Earth's ability to maintain us, but there's more to the discussion than whether, if you stood all of us shoulder-to-shoulder, we would fit inside a small city.
Amen! 100% Agree with Michelle!
ReplyDeleteOkay people who think the world is overpopulated....drive through Nebraska sometime.
ReplyDeleteI just looked at upcoming shows and it looks like an hour long show coming up March 27 about the miscarriage. Time to grab tissues.
ReplyDeleteOver population doesn't refer to not physically being able to fit onto the planet, it refers to lacking the necessary resources to sustain a population - which we do.
ReplyDeleteThe Duggars are takers, not givers. Michelle can argue until she is blue in the face, but families this size take up huge, huge amounts of our natural resources. For every hour they give, they also take hours upon hours FROM people in that they insist on living "on Duggar time" and keep people waiting. I know their philosophy is to homeschool and go to college online, then work within the family, but someday these children are going to have to meet with the "real world" and the "real world" doesn't adjust its schedule for one person that is "on Duggar time." Also, we are asked to respect the opinions of the Duggars to have such a massive family--why can't they respect the opinions of other that choose not to?
ReplyDeleteThe Duggars have always had respect for everyone they meet and come in contact with. They always say it is their chouce and everyone is individual and has to make the choice for themselves. It is not nice to reoresent them any other way
DeleteI think the Duggars have always been nonjudgemental towards others. But they do have a well reasoned and God fearing rationale for having as many children as God blesses them with. That is certainly very threatening to the secular culture.
DeleteIt's not a high birthrate that is driving global population, but a low Death rate. By the year 2100 the Population will be 10 Billion, but by 2200 it will only be 5 Billion. Trying to reduce birthrates won't solve anything and if the liberals were really serious they'd support euthanasia of the elderly. Plus reducing the birthrates would put more strain on the blue social programs like Social Security and Medicare, causing nations to run deficits thus creating debt crisis' like those in Greece. If I was a paranoid man I'd say that was a perfect way to collapse nations. The Cloward-Piven strategy of reducing the base and increasing the top will always cause Pyramids to fall over.
ReplyDeleteLacking natural resources to maintain life? Concerned about over-population?
ReplyDelete“Then Jesus said to his disciples: ‘Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat; or about your body, what you will wear. Life is more than food, and the body more than clothes. Consider the ravens: They do not sow or reap, they have no storeroom or barn; yet God feeds them. And how much more valuable you are than birds! Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life? Since you cannot do this very little thing, why do you worry about the rest?’” (Luke 12:22-26, NIV).
We, as humans, sometimes mistake that WE need to have all the answers and come up with all the solutions. In reality, WE are NOT in control, period. Just ask those who have been through a natural disaster (hurricane, tsunami, flooding, tornado etc.). Just ask the mother who one day is happily playing with her children and the next day one of those children is taken home to be with the Lord. Humans throughout history (check out the story of the Israelites in the Bible) have longed been deceived of this idea of being "in control" or of being confused about who they are as children of God. Whether a person wants to accept it... we all were made by God Himself and when it's our time to come home, we will know that for sure.
“Trust in the LORD with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding; in all your ways acknowledge him, and he will make your paths straight. Do not be wise in your own eyes; fear the LORD and shun evil. This will bring health to your body and nourishment to your bones” (Proverbs 3:5-8).
Quoting Michelle: "The claim that the world is over populated is actually a lie."
ReplyDeleteYou are claiming that the United Nations is lying. That's not very Christian of you.
http://esa.un.org/unpd/wpp/Documentation/pdf/WPP2010_Press_Release.pdf
WORLD OVER POPULATION IS A SERIOUS PROBLEM. See link above.
7 billion people standing shoulder to shoulder would not fit into the city limits of Jacksonville, FL.
In response to anonymous at March 14, 11:54 -
ReplyDeleteDo you believe that homeschooled students do not interact in the "real world"? Specifically, do you think the Duggars have not had that opportunity? I don't know any children who have had more real-world experiences than they have had. In general, I also believe the average homeschooler gets out in the real world much more frequently than the child who is confined to a school campus for so many hours a day.
Also, MANY cultures of the world operate on the same time schedule as the Duggars. You don't have to leave the United States to find these people, either. Do you have any international friends? Have you ever arrived at a party "on time", and realized you were early compared to everyone else? Have you ever had an appointment with someone who was 45 minutes late, and seemed to think it no worse than being 2 or 3 minutes late? Have you ever met a group of friends, then sat around chatting for an hour or two before moving on to planned activity? We Americans bristle at things like this, but in many cultures, we would be considered rude for being offended. Perhaps the Duggars are much more tolerant of others in this area, and will interact more lovingly than people who pride themselves on their punctuality.
Jim Bob and Michelle have mentioned that Jacksonville population quote before...it does seem hard to believe, so, just wondering where they heard that info., and in turn, how that source documents the accuracy of it?
ReplyDelete@ycfan
ReplyDeleteHi ycfan,
A National Geographic article written one year ago confirms that the world's population would fit in the city of Los Angeles. Since Jacksonville is the largest city by area in the contiguous United States, the world's population would most definitely fit in the city limits of Jacksonville.
~Lily and Ellie
The "world" operates on a time schedule. "Classes start at 8:30." "The tag office is open from 9:00-5:00." "Worship services are from 11:00-12:00." "Your dentist appointment is at 11:30." "The bus leaves at 10:00." I believe the Duggars are quite prompt at getting to places where they know will not wait on them. "The plane leaves at 2:00 with or without the Duggars." I don't think an airline would hold up a flight for an hour because the Duggars are on "Duggar time" and it would be selfish beyond belief to expect that. I think the point that is trying to be made is that the Duggars preach and preach and preach discipline, but they (by their own admission) are extremely undisciplined when it comes to being on time. Therefore, they affect others by their lack of discipline in this area. If Jim Bob thinks it takes 2 hours to get ready to go somewhere and they are consistently over and over and over again late by an hour and keep others waiting and wasting other's time, then Jim Bob needs to realize it actually takes 3 hours to get ready to go somewhere and if he would allow 3 hours, they would stop disrupting other people's schedules that they have an appointment with. We live in an organized society and it is just plain selfish to "buck the system" in this area. If you are late for your appointment by an hour, you disrupt the entire day for other people. I don't think this is what Jesus would encourage--I think Jesus would encourage the Duggars to rethink how long it takes them to get ready to go somewhere and to adjust their own schedule accordingly. I don't think Jesus would ask us to wait an extra hour because the Duggars are, well, the Duggars.
ReplyDeleteOkay. Let's all populate and go live arm to arm in Jacksonville. The Duggars will have to give up quite a roomy piece of land -- they preach it so they DO have to join us.
ReplyDeleteYou need to go read National Geographic again. July 28, 2000 == Too Many People.
ReplyDeleteThat would be the season finale it airs on March 27 the show will probably return sometime in June. Filming has already begun.
ReplyDelete@Anonymous
ReplyDeleteHi Anonymous,
Here is the link to the article. It also shows a video by National Geographic that states the statistic about Los Angeles:
http://www.bitrebels.com/lifestyle/national-geographic-the-world%E2%80%99s-population-our-planet/
By area, Jacksonville is larger than Los Angeles. Balance is the key.
~Lily and Ellie
God made the world and everything in it... God doesn't make mistakes; therefore, He would not put "too many" people on the earth. God doesn't do something and then go "Whoops! I forgot to create enough space and resources for my Creation!" He wants us to depend on Him and Him ALONE. And, until we do, we will have no peace.
ReplyDelete-He will provide for you, no matter what your circumstances may be or the circumstances of the world.
-Trust in Him and He will prove trustworthy.
-Cast your cares (even the ones of overpopulation ;)) on Him, for He cares greatly for YOU!
And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not alarmed, for this must take place, but the end is not yet. For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and there will be famines and earthquakes in various places. All these are but the beginning of the birth pains. ~Matthew 24:6-9
To 1Corinth: And your point is?????
ReplyDeleteGod doesn't seem to be protecting the rain forests and the quality of air that we breathe. That is our job. I get tired of people throwing up some quote about the entire population of the world living in Jackson or Texas or being stacked in the grand canyon. There ought to be a rule that if you use that type of folksy language you have to back it up with statistics about how many acres of farm land it takes to feed those people and the animals that they eat. You should also have to mention something about where those people are going to live and the infrastructure necessary to support them. Good for the Duggars for using second hand stuff but geeze, do a little reading on habitat destruction and pollution, while you are at it, destroying species that god put on the planet.
ReplyDeleteSpot on, Jangsu.
ReplyDeleteHahaha!! Watch behind Mrs. Duggar at 1:15-1:30 ;) I think one of her sons was about to go down the steps, then realized his mom was in an interview, so he leaves, then tries crawling down the stairs backwards but then realizes he would still be seen that way, so goes back upstairs x) haha it is quite funny ;D btw love what she's saying!
ReplyDeleteThey come up with folksy saying and catchy talking points to justify EVERYTHING they want or believe, it doesn't make it gospel truth! Area that people 'stood' shoulder to shoulder or actually 'fit' into does not equal area that people could live in with sustainable food, water and resources. By the way, perhaps she should pick up a grammar book while she is supposedly so effectively and efficiently homeschooling her brood/'stood shoulder to shoulder' were her exact words and they are painfully grammatically incorrect. Even though the comment was ridiculous figuratively and literally, she should have said 'stand shoulder to shoulder'. You would never know it by their folksy comments and actions, but here in the Ozarks in southwest Missouri, we actually do believe in quality education whether private, homeschool, or public education!
ReplyDelete@Anonymous
ReplyDeleteThat's a bit harsh, don't you think? How about checking your own grammar. I can find at least three mistakes in the first few sentences.
I admit the first time I heard about this family, I thought 'OMG, another one of those selfish couples who have no self-control'.... However, it all changed in my mind completely after I read some of how they raise their children and what their reasons are for having as many as they have. I really want to take my imaginary hat off before this couple and their smart, intelligent, creative and talented children - I myself don't plan to have any (unless maybe adoption some time down the line), but I am happy if people like the Duggars go ahead and do it, even so "many" - the world sure needs children that have been raised with respect, knowledge and true love (as opposed to selfish love). Bravo!
ReplyDelete"A National Geographic article written one year ago confirms that the world's population would fit in the city of Los Angeles. Since Jacksonville is the largest city by area in the contiguous United States, the world's population would most definitely fit in the city limits of Jacksonville."
ReplyDeleteAnd within a few days, many of those 7 billion people would be dead, due to lack of water or from disease. Cholera, ebola, and dysentery can kill within a few days, and they spread through food or water that's been contaminated by human waste. Being able to FIT all the world population into a small area doesn't mean you would be able to LIVE. We need clean water and food to live, and we produce a lot of waste that needs to be kept away from the water and food supply. Fitting the human population into Texas is not viable either - this allows about 100 square metres per person, not enough to allow for water treatment, sewage processing, or agriculture.
A lot of the earth isn't actually habitable (70% ocean) or wouldn't be able to support large numbers in decent living conditions (desert, tundra, mountains, etc.). I live in Canada - we're the second-largest country in the world, but a lot of our land is tundra. Tundra is useless in terms of producing goods, except for oil and mining. However, these industries consume a lot of resources, because of the cost of digging through frozen land and transporting goods - the ocean is frozen over most of the year, and the effects of freezing wear out roads and rail very quickly. There are no trees. You can't grow food in the arctic (except in a greenhouse, which requires electricity and heating), there are very few wild plants, it's not suitable for livestock, and even the wild animal populations are scarce. A lot of resources are non-renewable - oil and various elements (used to produce almost everything in your home) or have limited renewability (farmland, trees, wild animals and fish).
This is BASIC science. Almost no trained scientist will deny that overpopulation (referring to consumption of resources, not the physical size of the earth) is a growing problem.
Here is the basic math on Duggar population growth:
ReplyDeleteIf every Duggar marries at 20 and has 20 children by age 40, then 20 original Duggars = 400 in 40 years, in another 40 thats 8,000. In 200 years, those original 20 will result in 64 million. And in 40 years after that, 1.28 billion. By 2375 those original 20 from 2015 will result in over 10 trillion.
I was curious so I figured that out, and shared because I'm sure some people are wondering.